4 ways to maximize the value of your construction company

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Whether you’re planning to exit your company at some point or not, increasing its value over time should be one of your goals. This week, we’re discussing four actions you can take to up the value of your company.

Topics we cover in this episode include:

  • Becoming redundant in your company
  • Gaining control of an industry constraint
  • Claiming a 10x advantage 
  • The Rembrandt in your attic
  • Establishing steady growth 

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Rob Williams, Profit Strategist | IronGateESS.com
Wade Carpenter, CPA, CGMA | CarpenterCPAs.com
Stephen Brown, Bonding Expert | McWins.com


[00:00:00] Rob Williams: Welcome to the Contractor Success Forum. Today we’re discussing four actions contractors must do to maximize value when preparing to exit. Because we here on the Contractor Success Forum, discuss how to run a more profitable, successful construction business. We are your MBA for the construction business.

And with us today, we have Wade, Carpenter Carpenter, and Company, CPAs. And we have Stephen Brown with McDaniel-Whitley Bonding and Insurance Agency. And I’m Rob Williams with IronGate Entrepreneurial support Systems.

[00:00:42] Wade Carpenter: So Rob, what are these four things and why are we talking about that today?

[00:00:46] Rob Williams: So, yeah, there are four great things that I ran across actually I’m a Scaling Up coach and, and Verne Harnish has added a new chapter to his book about exit strategy, because that’s so important because we’re all gonna exit whether we want to or not. Is it voluntary or involuntary?

Be redundant in your company

[00:01:06] Rob Williams: The first thing you gotta do as the owner, be redundant in your company. I know that sounds like a negative thing, but that means the company can run without you. It can run when you’re not there day to day. And Wade, I guess you’ve heard about the four week vacation.

[00:01:24] Wade Carpenter: Oh yeah.

[00:01:24] Rob Williams: We’re also coaches in Profit First, and Mike Michalowicz has a lot of books and he talks about the four week vacation. And in order to do that, usually you’ll plan like 18 weeks ahead. It’s actually part of a whole program that, that some of us coach and you plan that week to be away for four weeks, four weeks without email, no phone calls. They said that’s impossible.

[00:01:51] Stephen Brown: It can’t be done.

[00:01:52] Rob Williams: Can’t be done. But what’s amazing is if they plan ahead and they do that, when they come back, almost always the company has been more successful when they’re gone and out of the way that month.

[00:02:04] Stephen Brown: Why is that? I don’t–

[00:02:06] Wade Carpenter: Well, if you prepare for it, I think that’s the, the key. And I think Rob’s talking about Mike Michalowicz’s Clockwork book, which the second edition just came out and I think it’s even better than the first.

[00:02:18] Rob Williams: It is.

[00:02:19] Wade Carpenter: Rob, can you tell us a little bit more about, why we do the four week vacation?

[00:02:23] Rob Williams: Yeah, when you do the four week vacation and, and you do this actually with your employees too. It may not be four weeks, it may be two weeks. It’s the test. It’s the big, you’ve gotta have a big theme a big something that pushes you over the edge. When we used to do lean manufacturing, we could not get it done unless there’s a crisis or something. And then you get that stuff done because you have to.

So if you put that, I know it’s a, it’s a false crisis that you’re creating by that vacation, but it still works. You’re forced to put those systems and processes in place and you’ve got month, after month, after month, all these things that you realize, you don’t even realize they’re tasks and processes because they’re in your head. You’ve gotta start defining them and get people to do those for you.

And if you can do that, that adds so much value to the company because as we said a minute ago, everyone exits, whether it’s voluntary or involuntary. And whether you’re leaving that to a kid or whether you’re leaving it to the employees, whether you’re selling that company, there’s an exit strategy, not necessarily retirement, but some kind of exit strategy.

I had a great business partner that died with his company and he had sort of done that. He was a big fan of the four hour work week, I think is a precursor to that, but the company’s actually still doing really well. And I remember when he would come back in that the company did run better when he was gone, he would come back in and stir everything up.

It can really happen and you just don’t realize. There’s so many things we don’t realize unless somebody points it out to us, or if we have something like this crisis of the vacation for a month. But the freedom that gives you as well. So why, why would you not want that? But it’s really hard to go about doing that.

But if you can do that and plan it, your company runs better. It’s a well oiled machine. And those business owner tasks really can be delegated. They can be done. I know it seems impossible, but you just have to have something that really, and the instigator, like that vacation, I know that that’s not the only way to do this. But that’s an impetus that helps that happen.

[00:04:41] Stephen Brown: It seems to me like it’s really a healthy exercise, and it’s more than an exercise. But it’s just about defining who you are and who your company is and what you want to accomplish.

[00:04:54] Rob Williams: Yeah. Well, and for the people when we’re also talking about increasing value of your company, just think about if you’re buying that company, sometimes it’s one of these banker investment firms, sometimes it’s another building company, sometimes who knows who it is. But imagine how much more secure they’re gonna feel if that company can run without you.

Because a lot of times, even when they buy the company, they bu y the owner with it, but then that owner may change his mind. He may be like burnout once it’s done. And he doesn’t choose to do all that work anymore because it’s not for him. And so they’re afraid of that. So that lessens the value of your company because it can’t run without you.

[00:05:36] Wade Carpenter: I think that was the point of Michael Gerber’s E-Myth Revisited. The more you can systematize and it doesn’t depend on you to be there, the more that company is going to get a higher multiple, because it doesn’t depend on one person to keep it going.

[00:05:52] Rob Williams: Yeah, all these guys quote Gerber. He or Jim Collins are kind of the very first guys, or I’m sure somebody was before them as well. But they’re the highly quoted ones that the new guys are referencing.

[00:06:04] Wade Carpenter: Yeah.

[00:06:05] Stephen Brown: Guys, I was talking about why this is a healthy idea. But I have a client that, his spouse who he worked with put her foot down and said, this is it. We’ve gotta spend some time together. And it really forced him to realize that, okay, well it’s my marriage or the business and I can do them both. I just have to work smarter, not harder. And this exit strategy, just is a genius idea. I don’t know why anyone wouldn’t at least give it some thoughtful consideration.

[00:06:36] Rob Williams: I tell you, growing up in the construction business, we’ve got this Marlboro man, this tough guy thing that it’s, it’s not okay to not work hard. It’s not okay to take time off. It’s not okay to not be there. It used to be, I, I remember for so long it was like a competition to who’s gonna get to the job first.

It’s okay guys, now it’s two hours before sunrise. This is a little bit early. So it’s like breakfast and, how many hours are there, before sunrise, and then we’re the last one after dark, and it, it’s just this thing that you’ve got in your mind.

And that mentality is often less of an owner’s mentality than it is the guys on the job. I think a lot of us that grew up in the construction business, we had those morals thrown at us from the workers. Many times the owners have a different mindset or the people with that smarter mindset, and they end up being the ones that run the successful companies, not the ones that are working their ass off in there. I think that’s one of the main reasons I can think of just for me, is it was not okay to delegate. It was not okay to not do all the work.

[00:07:50] Wade Carpenter: Yeah, and I think that’s a common problem, whether it’s in construction or any business owner. And we all wanna work hard and we want our business to succeed, but we tend to micromanage. And I remember when I was about probably five years into my own business and one of my employees called me, he’s like trying to be a martyr here. That term’s like, hey, made me think about that. But you know, to get away from that, I think working on getting away from the office, documenting your systems, automating as much as you can and not micromanaging, passing it off to your team. You’ve gotta trust the team or otherwise it’ll never get there.

[00:08:27] Rob Williams: You just nailed it, Wade. Being a martyr. I love that. That’s, that’s exactly what it is. It’s not, I’m using the Marlborough man absent, but that’s what everybody, they’re being a martyr.

[00:08:38] Wade Carpenter: Well, it kind of hit me when I was told that, so.

[00:08:42] Stephen Brown: This is my lot in life. Look how hard I work that it is, you’re right, a martyr mentality. It’s, it just seems to me that getting started has gotta be the main problem tackling something like this. How do you get started?

[00:08:59] Rob Williams: It’s through systems and processes. You’ve got it. You can get a coach. Just do that. Identify your processes. We can’t go through all that on this one. We’ve got some other episodes, or maybe we’ll add some, but, do start with those first seven processes you need to define, and then you as the owner, you really need to start looking at yourself as a process and a system. Not just in your head.

I think one of the venture capital guys was telling me the other day in a meeting I had up in Pennsylvania, as a buyer, they value good employees with processes more than a really exceptional person without a process. They would much rather see good employees with processes.

[00:09:42] Stephen Brown: So when you’re talking about processes, what are you talking about more specifically?

[00:09:47] Rob Williams: Defined. Have it documented in a way, I know I use a program to document things. So if you’re gone, somebody else can perform that task. It’s also, it provides for efficiency. Like when we talked about lean manufacturing, you get better and better. The one way to continue to get better is write down what you’re doing and then improve it.

It actually slows you down a little bit when you first do it, but then you can repeat it over and over again. I know I was a little slow to do it cause I would get frustrated. Because doing my accounting, Wade, I could do my typical weekly accounting like 30 minutes, but then when I documented it took two hours because I was having to go down the darn checklist. But then it got faster again over time.

[00:10:31] Wade Carpenter: And I think, for a lot of business owners, the thought of documenting all this stuff, it’s overwhelming. You think about all the systems that go into any business, and most people never start. And if you never start, you’re never gonna get anywhere.

[00:10:45] Rob Williams: Let’s talk about some other things that make the business valuable. I think that first one though is, is one of the biggest things because if the business can’t operate without you there, there is no value. And I know you’ve seen that, Stephen, with some of your contractors, if they pass away or something.

[00:11:02] Stephen Brown: Oh yeah. And it’s, it’s sad that as a bonding agent, we have to address that. It’s just not a happy topic. But what happens to you if you die, then you’re in bond claims? Your estate is. Is that what you want? Well, I have friends that’ll come in and finish this job. Okay. Well, may wanna formalize that a little bit.

Gain control of an industry constraint

[00:11:23] Rob Williams: Right. Okay. So one of the other things that’s really interesting is maximizing the value of it. If you can gain control of an industry constraint, you can really have a big value. And this is where we talk about strategic buyers versus financial buyers. I know that may make some people’s eyes roll back.

A financial buyer is somebody that buys your company for the earnings, that cash flow of what it’s happening right now. A strategic buyer may buy your company, yes, he’ll get that value if he continues running it that way. He’ll get that value of that cash flow. But there’s something that you have or you have control over something else. And this one we’re talking about an industry constraint.

This is not a construction example, but it was a really interesting example of an industry constraint. There were these soap people, I can’t remember if it was Colgate or Palm Olive, something. There were two of them, but one of them decided to buy the company that makes the little pump, and then the other company couldn’t use the little pump that pumped out the soap anymore. It’s wow, what an industry constraint.

What a smart move. It increased the value of that company that bought them like millions and millions of times, because they couldn’t have that pump. There was a patent on it. So the other company was dead in the water. When we think about the construction industry I think about industry constraints, with us an industry constraint, may be local because we have internal constraints and industry constraints. For us, labor was a big thing. And so I didn’t know–

[00:13:04] Stephen Brown: You had the labor.

[00:13:06] Rob Williams: Well, we didn’t have the labor. We, we got stuck. We could build about 350 houses a year and we were just stuck. We couldn’t get past there. Some of our constraints were the number of lots, and then the labor.

So two things that we did well, one, we were over 60% of the houses in that area of the, of the state. So we had the control of the lot. So that was a constraint that we controlled. So we had all of the lots, basically under a certain square footage, so we controlled that constraint. So that was a very good thing.

And the other thing that we did was we had to buy a heat and air company and a plumbing company, and did our trust manufacturing in lumber yards. So we could control those labors because the labor was just not there to build it.

So we dealt with the constraints. We didn’t buy the constraint like that pump on the thing. I guess there’s some people in this industry that may have a patent on something, that would be a good example of that.

[00:14:02] Wade Carpenter: Well, I’ve seen actually people buy construction companies just for their labor or a certain team that has some knowledge in a certain type of construction. On this podcast, we’ve used the example of like bath fitters. Where, you know, they have a process. Their value proposition is we can go in and get your bathroom done in a day. Well, how do you do that? There’s several ways to gain this industry constraint.

[00:14:28] Rob Williams: Yeah, that’s a great system and a process. And if it’s valuable, I, I think we had talked about another company that I know of, a construction company that got two totally different companies, one in Alaska and the other one in New York, but they had a process that these other companies had tried to do. And they managed, it was like a management software.

And this company didn’t even know that it was a thing. They just thought it was common sense. And they had that. Now we’re actually to the third thing. We’re actually talking about your internal 10 times advantage rather than an industry constraint. But it doesn’t really matter if you know the definition, whether it’s a industry constraint or a 10 times advantage, you just know you can do that.


[00:15:11] Wade Carpenter: Before we kind of move on from that, I, I do think it can be either people or technology or material supply chain. It can just be the process. Just even my business, the thing that I’ve kind of built over the years is I saw there was a hole in the market to where it’s really tough to do construction accounting remotely, and nobody had a system to do what I wanted to do with things like payables.

So we ended up building our own technology to take care of that. And people still tell me, I’ve never seen a system like, So, it can be just how you do it, automating it, controlling the materials, controlling the labor. There’s any number of things where you can gain a competitive advantage when you think about your process.

[00:16:00] Stephen Brown: You have to start thinking about what you do better than anybody else, and what could you do to make yourself better than everybody else.

[00:16:08] Wade Carpenter: Right.

Have a 10x Advantage

[00:16:09] Rob Williams: That’s the third one. That’s what we call a 10 times advantage. What can you do to have a 10 times advantage over anybody else in your industry?

[00:16:18] Stephen Brown: So, where’d you come up with 10 times? Is that–

[00:16:21] Rob Williams: I didn’t come up with it. Verne Harish did in the book and he probably got it from Gerber or somebody else, but it, I think it has a ring to it.

[00:16:29] Stephen Brown: Yeah, let’s just take, let’s just accept it. I’m sorry. Go–

[00:16:31] Rob Williams: Yeah, no, no, that’s good. It’s kinda funny. I think of the same thing, but that is sort of a rule of thumb because some people actually wanna say a hundred times.

[00:16:41] Stephen Brown: Yeah. But 10 times as doable.

[00:16:43] Rob Williams: Yeah, maybe they say 10 times because that’s when you get somebody that looks at you and it puts value to your company. If you’re not just a little bit better, but you’re multiple times better. Wade has really found that sweet spot because he is at least 10 times, say it’s a hundred times better, you know at that than the regular accountant that doesn’t do construction accounting, yeah.

Yeah. 10 times would be an understatement compared to just somebody that doesn’t know construction accounting.

[00:17:11] Wade Carpenter: Going back to the example of like bath fitters, I mean they, yeah, they’ve got a process to get it in, but they’ve also got a reputation. They’ve got a brand that they’ve built. And people across the nation, I don’t know how far their franchises go, but I know they’re spread around the country. But the more they can do that, the more value it does have to getting more work and knowing the value proposition versus, Joe’s Construction over here that does a bath and then does a basement and does anything under the sun. They’re not necessarily as efficient as somebody that’s got the process down.

The Rembrandt in your attic

[00:17:48] Rob Williams: Yeah. There’s a term for what they call some of these, gaining the industry constraint or this 10 times advantage. And there’s a story, they call this a Rembrandt in your attic. So what, what does that mean? Say Wade, you’ve got your house for sale. And then Stephen is in there and some other person’s looking at your house and say, it’s a million dollar house and I don’t know where you live or what your house is, but I know you’re near live near Atlanta and they’re pretty expensive, but stephen likes that backyard, he really likes that. So he’s this is a million dollar house. There’s somebody else was offering 950,000. I’m gonna offer $1,050,000 and I’m gonna get this house. I’m going 50,000 over.

Well, Rob comes in and he goes up there in the attic and he had his sister with him, who’s Ms. Art Connoisseur. She said, what is that painting up there? Oh my gosh. It’s a Rembrandt. It’s an original Rembrandt. And it comes with the house. Everything comes with the house. That thing’s worth 14 million. So when they come out and they bid that house, they’re not gonna tell the owner that that’s in there and the owner doesn’t know about it.

But that person is gonna pay a lot more than a million dollars for that house because it comes with the Rembrandt in the attic.

[00:19:06] Wade Carpenter: That’s a great analogy. Sometimes business owners don’t see the things that other people see in your business. And sometimes there’s value you don’t recognize because you got that tunnel vision. You’ve been working it every day for 30 years.

[00:19:22] Stephen Brown: And there’s hidden value you don’t know about. But I can tell you, buying a Wade Carpenter house would have the prestige of buying a Frank Lloyd Wright house.

[00:19:30] Wade Carpenter: I’m not sure you’d agree if you come see my house. I got, I got a broken step on the front porch, so. I need to get that fixed.

[00:19:38] Rob Williams: That Rembrandt make up the value of–

[00:19:39] Stephen Brown: It’s the prestige. It’s the prestige.

[00:19:42] Rob Williams: Yeah, yeah. But, you nailed it. The Rembrandt and the in the attic, the owner never knows it’s there. In your business. The special thing that you’ve got, that 10 times advantage that you’ve got, you think it’s common sense as the owner. You think everybody has it. It’s some system that you’ve got, well, hadn’t everybody made this computer system? It doesn’t matter if it’s simple.

Doesn’t matter. It matter if it’s complicated. You just don’t know it’s there. And so we, Wade and Stephen, when we’re looking at these people, we need to be helping people look for these, and especially if we’re doing coaching with them. So looking for these Rembrandts and putting that value, and then that’s when you look for the strategic buyer.

You hear about these people getting 20 times multiples and, and that may confuse some of you guys. People value companies usually take your income, we’ll call it EBITDA– if you don’t know what EBITDA is, just say your profit for the year times a certain number of things.

Maybe they’ll give you five years worth, times five. Well, if there’s some kind of Rembrandt in that attic, you may get a 20 times multiple or a 70 times multiple. And I’ve seen it happen, but I didn’t understand, what was it? Why did they get this? I thought maybe the projected growth was faster, something like that.

But it’s usually a strategic advantage that somebody’s buying your company. Yes, strategery. They’re not just buying it because you’re on a really upswing. That’s what I thought would increase our value is how fast we’re growing, which that does help because you can project that in there. But that strategic advantage, I didn’t know that that was a thing.

[00:21:18] Wade Carpenter: Yep.

Establish steady growth

[00:21:19] Rob Williams: Speaking of, number four is steady growth. Establish steady growth. Wade, is that important in your valuations?

[00:21:27] Wade Carpenter: Well, absolutely. And it depends on the industry, but in construction, it’s nice to see that somebody can grow, but grow consistently and not outgrow their cash flow. So having that healthy company that can grow, it’s exciting to see a buyer that can see where the trend goes straight on up. That kind of makes it desirable for that potential buyer.

[00:21:50] Rob Williams: And Stephen, as you’re the bonding person, is it important for you to see revenue, gross margin, and net profit all being positive?

[00:22:00] Stephen Brown: It’s all about the gross profit and whether you have enough overhead to make your net profit negligible. But you know, that net income that you make goes back into the company for the next year for operating purposes. And I’m just talking about looking at a fiscal year end financial statement.

But Wade just said growing based on your ability to cash flow, guys, if you ask questions about what that means, you really need to listen to our podcast, because that’s all we talk about is, is maximizing cash flow. It’s like I said, we ought change the name of this thing to Maximizing Cash Flow podcast. It’s sad, but it’s true.

All of this may sound boring. But cash flow is not. And making a profit is not boring. It’s the only way to go.

[00:22:46] Wade Carpenter: Yep.

[00:22:47] Rob Williams: Oh yes. So the point is, if you like it as a bonding agent, Wade, wouldn’t a buyer like to see revenue growing, gross margin at least staying the same percent margin or growing at the same time, and that net profit? So many of these business owners that are trying to sell their company, they start growing the revenue at the expense of their net profit or their gross margin.

John that I was talking to that does mergers and acquisition things, he said,  these buyers want to see that that gross margin is not dwindling. Because the more they grow, the more it’ll dwindle. They wanna see that gross margin improving or at least staying the same, and then that net margin staying the same. So you’ve got to grow all three. I’ve just seen over and over again people just want their top line growth to be better, and think that’s gonna improve the value. It might destroy the value.

[00:23:44] Wade Carpenter: Exactly. We’ve talked on here as well about growing for the sake of growing that top line, and I think that’s a mistake.

One of the things in addition to cash flow that I think I see in all businesses, but construction especially, is sometimes we hang on to a line of business that is not as profitable, but we get revenue from it.

An example might be, say, a handyman that does also some restoration work and works for insurance companies. And they hold onto it because it’s a bunch of revenue. But When they look at it, it’s well, these guys do pay me, but it really is a lower margin than these, custom, renovations we do. The cash flow is terrible because we’re waiting on insurance companies and all this stuff to be signed off on.

So, point I’m making here is sometimes you gotta get rid of certain lines of business to make way for the growth. And that sounds counterintuitive. I’m going through it in my business. For me to see growth, I’ve had to let go of certain clients at times to make room for the more profitable clients.

[00:25:00] Rob Williams: Yeah. You gotta keep that margin and that net profit over, because sometimes it’s not just the direct cost, it’s the indirect cost that’ll affect you. And we’ve had some other conversations about that as well on some other episodes because we have so many great episodes on here, don’t we, Stephen?

[00:25:15] Stephen Brown: I don’t know. It’s just kind of sad thinking about how many of my non-profitable clients just love me so much. They’ll never let me go.

[00:25:24] Rob Williams: Yeah. Right.

[00:25:26] Stephen Brown: It’s no, it’s over. No. No, it’s not. It can’t be.

But Wade, that’s such a good point. And I think this really ties in to this great topic, guys. Exit plan is not about exiting, it’s about growing.

[00:25:43] Rob Williams: Yep. Yep. You know, One thing I wanted to add, I was looking at my notes on establishing that steady growth. Most people wanna sell as much as they can, and I was introduced to the concepts of these sales systems, and you can have a sales system that you can dial it in. A lot of those buyers want to see that people have a sales process for that growth, that there is a factor that they can spend. Is it a do number of dollar of advertising or something in some factor number of calls that they can increase and decrease.

They don’t sell as much as they can. They sell to maximize their profit. Typically, they can sell more than they’re gonna do, which is a complete foreign concept to me. We always sold as much as we could and then figured out how to get it done, but I think about how much we spent to get those extra houses done. We spent a lot of times exorbitant amounts of overhead things just to push that volume through.

So if you’ve got a sales system that could keep that volume right where you need it, I didn’t understand how these people could be steady all the time. We were always so up and down. Sell to the volume that you want, and that’s how much you’re gonna sell this year.

And then you can be so much more efficient, you’re actually gonna make a lot more money doing that, then selling every single thing you can. That’s a foreign concept, and when I talk to people about that, they’re like, okay, Rob, I don’t know if I believe you on that one, but it’s–

[00:27:16] Stephen Brown: No, no, it is, it is true. You, you say, oh my gosh, well, my, you don’t know how cyclical my business is. Sometimes there’s just a lot of work out to be done, and sometimes there isn’t. And I just gotta do what I have to do to keep everybody fed.

That’s not the right attitude to have. It’s not true either. And we could talk about examples of why that isn’t true and we could argue all day long, but it’s not true. So that might be another discussion we need to have on the Contractor. Success. Forum.

[00:27:50] Rob Williams: That’s right, get some sales systems.

[00:27:52] Stephen Brown: Yeah.

[00:27:53] Wade Carpenter: Stephen and I both know that we deal with people and nobody wants to talk about exiting. They don’t wanna talk about dying or anything like that. But back to Michael Gerber, the point of his book is run your business as if you were going to sell it, even if that’s not your intention. And that helps build the value. And I hope that makes sense.

[00:28:12] Rob Williams: It really does because you know, master all four of these things that we talked about today, and a lot of the times people get there and they start getting the offers from other people and well, why wouldn’t I keep it for that? If it’s five years income, well why would I sell it for five years?

I can just come in an hour a week or something. Keep it for 20 years and keep this income. So why would I sell it? So a lot of times when you do go through these steps, you’ve created a situation that you love so much that you don’t wanna sell it anymore, which makes you a lot more competitive seller that you can get more for it if, if you are trying to sell it. But then you just may not wanna sell it anymore.

[00:28:57] Stephen Brown: Well, you’re being strategic either way.

[00:29:02] Rob Williams: That’s right.

[00:29:03] Stephen Brown: And practicing–

[00:29:04] Rob Williams: Strategy here on the Contractor. Success. Forum, . All right guys.

[00:29:10] Stephen Brown: Rob, good topics. Thanks.

[00:29:12] Rob Williams: Wade’s done a lot of valuation and those kind of things too. So, this has been a great concept. Anything else?

[00:29:17] Wade Carpenter: Not anything here, but I did wanna mention that we’ve had a lot of interest in our YouTube channel that’s, we’re finally, seeing a lot of traction in that, and I’d love to see if you would, and subscribe to us because we are trying to build the brand and we’ve gotten some great feedback on the YouTube channel as well.

[00:29:35] Rob Williams: Yeah, that’s a great point. Yeah, everybody go on there, subscribe. That will help us too as well. So if we get more subscription, then it will get out. So, we’d really appreciate if you guys would subscribe on the YouTube channel.

All right. Well, I appreciate it and when you’re doing the sales, get somebody to help coach you on that. If you’re looking for something some of us can help with that as well, on how to implement some of these four contractor actions. Thanks for coming to the Contractor Success Forum. We’ll see you on the next one.

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